Live from Worlds – Women’s All-Around Final

The Simone Show has rolled into town for another year, and while no one has any doubts about the gold-related results (although I am interested to see what she goes for in terms of vault and beam dismount from a strategic perspective), the other medals should be a serious race.

Sunisa Lee has the highest scoring potential of the remaining contenders and will be considered the default for silver, but she doesn’t have a mistake-proof margin over the best of the field, so she’s going to have to hit. Heading in, the consensus has been that Melanie DJDS enjoys the best shot of the non-Americans to get a medal, and I agree, but it will be an “any given day” situation between her and the likes of Melnikova or Li Shijia or Ellie Black being all Ellie Black and taking advantage of the mistakes of others.

We already have some news about the field, where Liu Tingting has withdrawn from the final and been replaced by Tang Xijing, who was originally 2-per-ed out. Tang will rotate in Liu’s spot, so she’ll be in the vault group with the leaders.

“[German] [German] [German] Simone Biles [German] [German] [German]” has been our in-arena intro to the competition so far. I mean same.

“Lights on for this guy.” Lukas SetNewSigns is here for every day of finals singing about putting political signs in your front yard or something.

One-by-one intros because AA final, so we’re not going to get any choreography, especially because Eythora isn’t even in this final so what’s the point?

Germany has its chalk umbrella out in prepping the bars, and then it was immediately dropped, defeating the purpose entirely.

Rotation 1

CA pouring out one for Grace McCallum in her PA intro.

Simone is working the Cheng in her warmup.

Teramoto – BB – wolf double, hit – double turn, minor check – aerial to split jump straddle jump, solid – onodi, strong – switch – side somi, very secure – bhs loso, right on – side aerail, only the smallest movement 2.5, small step

Melanie – VT – nice DTY, good chest position and direction, medium bounce back. 14.633

Seitz – UB – Maloney to Ricna, solid – piked jaeger, hit – Downie to pak to stalder shap 1/2, good, struggles a little to cast out with some muscles – full to FTDT, small hop. Nice start. 14.866

Lee – VT – one of her strong DTYs, small hop, some legs and chest position, but better landing control than MDJDS, so will be interesting to compare scores.

Black – UB – Maloney to hindorff, good – Chang, solid – piked jaeger to pak, good rhythm, some crazy legs on pak – VL, a little leg break – some handstand positions but not too bad – toe on tuck 1/2, stuck. Ellie did Ellie. 14.133

Biles – VT – Cheng goes out 8000 million feet as it did in the team competition, still a fairly large bounce back but will be a huge score of course. 15.233

Nina – UB – nabieva – DF to yezhova to shap to pak to van leeuwen, glorious – toe full to FTDT, small hop in place. Great. 15.200

Great DTY for Li Shijia, basically stuck. Doesn’t have the height and distance of the others, but great landing.

Good double front for Godwin on FX, just a little short on DLO but a small hop – front full, dances out – double pike, short with a lunge. 13.233

Villa – UB – stalder shap to tkatchev, good – ricna to pak to maloney to bhardaj, excellent – van leeuwen, hit – front giant full, has to shift over for her dismount, double front, hit. Some moments where she was close on a release and struggled to get to handstand on the next cast, but otherwise solid. 14.333

Tang Xijing short on DTY with a lunge forward.

Voss – BB – bhs bhs loso, only a small lean – looks like she got her split leap full around – aerial to split bhs, good,, split position was lovely – side somi, strong – near stick on 2.5. Good. 13.866

Akhaimova – UB – channeling a stained glass window in her leo – inbar full to maloney to giant full to tkatchev, falls on TKatchev – the stained glass window has shattered

Melnikova – VT – DTY – solid distance but also a pretty large bounce back, and leg form to take, so this shouldn’t be among the highest DTY scores we’ve seen but close. 14.433

Iorio – BB – large break on loso mount but keeps it on the beam – side aerial, small clench correction – switch to split leap, lovely – bhs loso loso, held solidly. 12.666

Flavia – UB – piked tkatchev to pak, butt scraper as always but hit – toe on to maloney to tkatchev, same but hit – cast 1/2 actually good vertical – double front, pace forward, got through it. 13.300

Lovely stuck 2/1 from Cintia to finish her routine. 12.600

Steingruber – BB – switch mount, hit – aerial, solid – front tuck, leg-up check but not too big – bhs loso, small lean correction – front pike, another check but saved it, possible tuck credit – switch to side somi, large lean and bend but stays on – switch 1/2, not bad 180 position but feet – gainer “layout” 1/1 off the end, small hop. I mean, it was as terrifying as Steingruber’s beam is, but no fall. 12.800

Varinska – FX – 1.5 through to 3/1, step to the side, crazy legs – double L, started to lean but I’d give it – 2.5 to front tuck, bounce – split leap full, around – switch ring, nice – split ring leap – memmel turn, nice – double tuck, stuck. Nice. I’d give her D turns, so that will be important for the score. 13.400

Friess – BB – wolf to split jump – round off layout, only a small check, some foot form, but good – front tuck, very solid – switch – switch 1/2, just a bit o position – lone back tuck, solid – wolf single – double tuck, hop back

Moors – FX – Podkopayeva, a little shuffle back this time, no connection – front 2/1 to front full solid landing, some knees – double attitude turn – switch ring , pretty – split ring leap 1/2, not even bad – split jump 1/1 – 2.5 combo loses form a little. Lovely of course.

After 1:
1. Biles – 15.233
2. Derwael – 15.200
3. Seitz – 14.866
4. DJDS – 14.633
5. Lee – 14.466

Rotation 2

Black – BB – switch mount, solid – double turn, nicely done – front ruck, solid – bhs layout, whipped as usual but secure, also as usual – switch to switch 1/2 to bhs, solid rhythm, not hitting the position on the switch 1/2 – side somi, smallest arm correction – 2.5, medium hop forward. 14.000. She’s on.

Kinsella’s landing on double pike was a little jarring, otherwise hit routine. 12.933

Deep Y1.5 from Hatakeda, bounce forward. 13.800

Lee – UB – Nabieva – to pak, got crazy in the legs, hit the mat with her foot, couldn’t cast out of it, and she’s off the bars – the rest of her routine is glorious of course – FTDT, small hop forward. 13.133. Eesh.

Derwael looking exceptionally solid on beam – stuck gainer pike full dismount. 13.733

Voss has an awkward landing and pops OOB with several hops

Biles – UB – weiler 1/2 to maloney to tkatchev, good – short hs on high – toe full excellent into piked jaeger to pak – toe shap 1/2 – double double tucked, basically stuck, a quiver of one foot. Just a couple handstands, one of her stronger bars routines. 14.733

Iorio – FX – 3/1, bounce, some legs – memmel into illusion – double pike, short, bounce forward – switch ring – split leap full – front full, bounce –

Villa – BB – keeps her tuck full on the beam today – leg up check but hit -but then she falls on a wolf turn double!

Visser decides to do just the full on vault, short witha hop forward

Li Shijia – UB – piked jaeger, a little low but good – rcina to pak, some legs, a bit of mescling out – maloney to gienger, hit – toe on – full, loses form, keeps going but has a totally tucked giant after that – FTDT, deep but solid. Stayed on the bars but between that full turn and some other muscled cast problems, it will be like a fall. 13.366

Steingruber – FX – awesome split leap 1.5 – DLO 1/1, super strong, small slide back – DLO, stuck – some feet on switch full but around – double tuck, solid – double pike, step back, would be NCAA controlled step – excellent routine.13.633

Akhaimova – BB – step on front tuck mount – falls on her layout series, she’s done with this meet

Tang – UB – Maloney to pak, lovely form – VL, a little low but fine – healy to ling to front giant full to piked jaeger, great – cast 1/2, late – DLO, stuck landing, really good

Friess – FX – double arabian, well controlled landing – split leap full – full in, bounce back, she has legs together technique in these passes through –

Flavia – BB – bhs mount to split jump to swing down, good – layout, super solid – split leap to sissone – bhs loso loso, right on – switch ring, perfect in the air of course but the first break in the routine, bend at the hops – aerial, small check – split ring jump – side somi, step to control it – split ring leap, the only acceptable one – double pike, small hop. Nice.

Melnikova UB – inbar full to toe shap to pak- van leeuwen, only a bit of legs – inbar 1/2, pulls it around with a little pause – hits piked jaeger – another pause trying to get over on her toe full into her dismount, she does it again but two pretty significant issues there. 13.900

Seitz – BB – switch leap mount, strong – front tuck, small check -bhs back pike, step, but mostly solid – side somi, hit with arm wave – double turn, controls it – switch to wolf – side aerial – punch frotn layout full, small hop. OK, so that was basically her best beam routine in years. 13.233

DJDS – UB – Falls on her Galante. MELANIE. Redoes the skill and hits, in Pak – Maloney to bhardwaj and she comes off again – she finishes the routine successfully, small hop on DLO 1/1, but that’s a two fall routine. No coming back from that.

Derwael is like LA LA LA at this point.

After 2:
1. Biles – 29.966
2. Derwael – 28.933
3. Tang – 28.699
4. Melnikova – 28.333
5. Black – 28.133

Rotation 3

Biles – BB – wolf turn triple, fast and secure – aerial to split to straddle, pause before split, broken connection – bhs loso loso, right on – switch to switch 1/2 to back pike, nice and well connection – side aerial – split jump 1/2 from side position, medium lean – bhs bhs FTDT, no double double today, a little short with a hop. A third good hit. 14.633

Hit DTY from Voss.

Derwael – FX – split leap full, good – double tuck, hop back – of the Belgian routines, this one doesn’t really work for me – leans out of her Memmel turn a bit too much – pulls around her wolf triple well – 1.5 to front full, little slide – switch ring – split leap . 13.500

Near knees down vault from Iorio

Great rudi from Steingruber, small step back, leg form, but will score well.

Li SJ – BB – switch to split ring leap, broken connection in bhs – side aerial, lovely – fhs to front tuck, small step forward – switch ring to bhs, a little pause – aerial to split ring jump – a little pause again, wondering how the D score will look because a lit of these series are borderline – full turn, little check – double pike, large stumble back, multiple lunges. That won’t help. 13.700 is quite high for me. And it was upped to 14.000 after inquiry. Now it’s REALLY high for me.

Good control on FTDT from Villa, though he wolf turn double attempt got crazy, def only a single. Her next one is also a little weak, hand down to slide it around – double tuck, a bit short – 12.566

Hit rudis from Friess and Teramoto as well. I love that this 3rd-group vault rotation is casually amazing.

Varinska – BB – shap to pak to maleony to clear hip full, very late – tkatchev 1/2 to jaeger is hit, lots of form but hit – toe full to FTDT, small hop

Bounce back on DTY from Kinsella.

Tang – BB – loso mount, perfect – round off to highhhh layout, lovely – switch ring to split ring jump to bhs, lovely – switch to split ring leap, pause before bhs and a leg-up check – full turn – aerial to split to stag ring, solid – 2/1 dismount, bounce back and another step. 14.600

Moors – UB – Shap to pak, only a bit of legs – toe full, a bit late – Van leeuwen, solid – clear hip khrokina, hit today – toe pike 1/2, small hop. Nice. 13.266

Visser – UB – stalder to stalder shap, but falls on a shap 1/2 attempt. I mostly blame the guy who tripped down the entirety of the stairs right next to bars as that was happening. She’s really struggling with another break here.

Very long waits on BB and FX for the scores for Tang and Akhaimova.

Melnikova – BB – switch leap mount – bhs loso series, nice control and extension – aerial to split to straddle – bhs 1/1, off line but pulls it back – wolf double, super solid – side somi, controlled well – split jump 1/2 from side, excellent – ro double pike, medium hop back. Who is this woman who’s good at beam now? 14.000

Saraiva – FX – whip to DLO, pretty solid, small hop forward – switch leap full, lovely height – full in, lage bounce back, does well to keep it in bounds – 1.5 to front full – memmel turn well controlled, worried she dropped a little early but good control – double pike, step back -13.933

Melanie hits her front pike on beam today but with a leg-up check – another fairly large check on her layout – double tuck, bounce back. 13.500

Seitz – FX – double arabian, short with a step 13.300

Lee – BB – wolf triple, very well controlled – split to sissone, nice – aerial, clean – bhs bhs layout, two small steps but keeps it on the beam – switch to switch 1/2, large break on switch 1/2, leg-up wobble – side aerial to loso loso, right on – switch ring, a little arm wave – split ring jump – double tuck, deep, bounce back. Stayed on but some major deductions in there13.833

Black – FX – popa, solid – front full through to 3/1, hit, smalide back, a little under on rotation – 2.5 throguht to double pike, also a bit short but pulls it out with a hop – straight jump 1/1 through to switch – front 2/1, a little under with a hop to the side

13.533 and into 6th place.

After 3:
1. Biles – 44.599
2. Tang – 43.299
3. Derwael – 42.433
4. Melnikova – 42.333
5. Li – 41.799

Rotation 4

Li – FX – 3/1, bounce back, some leg position – 2.5 to front pike, solid – popa, nice extension – switch ring – double tuck, lowish, lunge back – double pike, another bounce – 13.300

Villa – VT – great stick on her DTY, just some knees in the air, but awesome vault. 14.700

Varinska nearly off on her series but saves it.

Tang – FX – 3/1 to punch front, landed that triple full fully 2.75 and did the punch front sideways, but whatever, 2.5 to front pike, solid – triple turn – double tuck, bounce back – switch ring – 2/1, small slide. 13.600 is quite high.

Quite the day for Tang Gutsu.

Flavia just a tad short on DTY, step forward

Seitz – VT – really nice DTY, she had a great day, small hop back, some knees, but chest up and well completed. 14.600

Moors – BB – switch to split ring jump, feet but hit – fhs to front tuck, step forward, kept on the beam – smooth aerial –

Melnikova – FX – DLO 1/1, small hop back – double L turn to double turn, good – DLO, very floaty, small slide back – switch ring 1/2 – front tuck through to 2/1, small hop – wolf turn triple – memmel turn, questionable credit with that finishing position – double pike, bit larger slide back, nice routine. 14.066. Into 2nd behind Tang with Biles and Derwael still to go.

Black – VT – she did the rudi! And it was a bad idea! She looks like she hurt her angle is struggling to get off the mat. Landed short in a total ankle cruncher, didn’t fall though. She’s in 3rd now behind Tang and Melnikova

Derwael – VT – quite the large bounce back on her full today, interesting

MDJDS comes back with a hit on floor, though did go OOB on her third pass.

13.600! Not enough for Nina. She’s in behind Ellie Black.

13.500 for MDJDS on floor, and she’s into 16th place. SIGHx50

Lee – FX – double double, a littl deep, hop to the side – DLO, pretty solid, just a little piking at the end, small movement – pulls around her triple wolf and double, a little slow – 1.5 to front full, small hop – switch ring – double tuck, a bit short, hop forward. Three hit events for her today, but she needed four. 14.200 is a little highf ro that one for me.

Godwin finishing up on beam – bhs back pike series, secure – aerial – switch to sissone – wolf turn double – double pike, small hop. 13.366

Biles – FX – triple double, bounces way back and OOB – Biles, another lunge forward, just did say in bounds, no connection – wolf double, fine, a little over turned – full in, no trouble – split leap 1.5 awesome – double double, another bounce back and OOB. Because staying in bounds is for losers. 14.400

FINAL:
1. Biles – 58.999
2. Tang – 56.899
3. Melnikova – 56.399
4. Black – 56.232
5. Derwael – 56.033

You know, like you predicted the silver medalist would be.

Oh, I couldn’t see the Simone mic drop from my angle. Being places is way overrated you guys.

Today, an acro team called either Dreaming Jet Collection or Dreamy Jack o Lantern is performing Sad Musical Chairs for us before the medal ceremony

Ellie Black on crutches for the award ceremony. Saddest.

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142 thoughts on “Live from Worlds – Women’s All-Around Final”

    1. Not even in her dreams unless Melnikova falls three times and Lee falls two or three more times and Black falls as well. Derwael has ZERO floor and vault difficulty. She gives away 1.5-2 points there.

      Liked by 2 people

      1. Derwael gets stupidly high floor scores in spite of her lack of difficulty there and has made floor finals. I think she has a good shot at the podium unfortunately, depending on what Black and Melnikova do.

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      2. @Anonymous So true about Derwael’s form. Apparently, being tall gets her ‘form points’ *vomits* Same lousy feet as on bars, and then there’s her Level 6 ‘difficulty’…

        Liked by 1 person

      3. I agree in that no matter how much I love her and think she is fantastic. The idea of medalling in the All Around at world with a Yurchenko Full, just two tumbling passes (a double tuck, and a 1.5 punch front full) is a little depressing.

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    2. @Anonymous Let’s remember she’s a ‘floor finalist’ because of a) asinine two-per legislation; b) Moors getting skeerewed on her inquiry; and c) a few falls in qualification from actual legit contenders on floor. I’m sure you saw the excuse for a floor routine Derwael just did? LOL!

      Liked by 1 person

      1. @Anonymous And she will finish dead last in that final, even with the absurd and unfair gifts the judges give her.

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    3. Not a fan of derwael! I’ll be upset bc she’s not an all around gymnast. She has great bars and decent beam but her floor should NOT be as highly scored as it is. Definitely something wrong with the code of points for her to be able to make floor finals with a double tick, a twisting combo and some wolf turns.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I’m fine with her doing what she can, but I want her to be judged appropriately for it. She is not an AA gymnast and has finished 5th AA in the world twice in a row.

        The problem is with the code and with the judging, not with her and I realize it is coming out as hate for her, but it frustrates me to see her doing so well over other more well, rounded gymnasts.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. I think it’s a bit unfair to criticize her for finishing high in the AA consistently.we’re seeing her do that because she plays to her strengths and actually HITS consistently when most of the top contenders (and plenty of my faves, I’m not exactly a Nina fan girl) falter. Plenty of the top non-US “All Arounders” have at least one weak event, and Nina’s no different. Idk why she seems to draw the most hateful comments, but jeez y’all can be spiteful. She’s a human being.

        Liked by 1 person

      3. @Linsea ‘Hateful’ and ‘spiteful?’ What drugs are you on? Correct and truthful statements about Derwael’s huge weaknesses are hardly ‘hate’ or ‘spite.’ The truth apparently hurts you more than you want to admit, and I’m not impressed or convinced by your disavowal of being a Ninafanstan either. Our comments are about abominable CoP, codewhoring, and judging; no one has made any uncomplimentary observations about the gymnast other than to point out her obvious flaws –which is done with every gymnast, in case you know even less than you appear to. Simone Biles, for example, has been vilified since day one for her choreography and dance on floor; the amount of Aly Raisman hatred (which it truly was in that case, unlike this one!) was overwhelming, and by no means just limited to her bars routine. Derwael does not have ONE weak event; she has TWO *abysmally inadequate* events and gets by with a ludicrously low difficulty on beam because she is tall and skinny–her beam is nothing special in any way. Give the ‘poor Nina’ and ‘y’all are so mean and awful’ bilge a nice long rest, why don’t you?

        Liked by 1 person

    4. @lovelovepeacepeaceuk LOL@your asinine characterization of truthful observations about the outrageous OVERSKORING of Derwael as ‘hate.’ Actually, no one here hates Derwael; we hate the stupid CoP and the judges who have made Derwael their very own little pet in spite of vault and floor routines which do not deserve to appear in a World Championship. Fixed it all for you; you’re welcome!

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  1. How on earth is Flavia’s beam E-score the same as Seitz’s and lower than Black’s? The larger check on the switch ring and the two smaller checks should be all they are taking UGH

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  2. UGGGGGH. Melanie *and* Suni all over the place. Well, all Melka has to do now is stay on beam and not have multiple OOBs on floor.

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    1. He is possibly a bigger and stupider boob than even Al Trautwig. How Daggett EVER got that job is beyond the wit of mortal man–he sure ain’t purty enough to want to fuck, and never was!

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  3. LOL, I think Villa and Iorio are just completely burned out at this point. Iorio in particular burst into tears immediately after dismounting the beam in TF and doesn’t seem to have recovered. No problem, they’ve already won their Worlds. 🙂

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    1. @Matthew Boyle Little troll, not even in your wettest wet dreams does Simone Biles have splat fests. Sunisa Lee is having a bad meet, as is your pet robot Jade Carey by the way (no floor final for your favorite? Awwwwww……)

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I second this. TBH I enjoy watching her as much as I do the more “artistic” gymnasts, sometimes more, because her tumbling is so amazing. Not going to defend her presentation, which is distractingly poor, but honestly I find low-difficulty tumbling to be equally off-putting at the elite level. Very few gymnasts are really able to pull off the combination of difficulty and artistry.

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    1. Jade is fine on vault which is a technical event and doesn’t require artistry.

      I would be happy if I NEVER have to see a Jade floor routine again – I don’t care about the difficulty in her floor passes, she should have major deductions for murdering artistry.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Lots of complaints about Nina’s floor on here, which are valid. But Jade’s floor is as lacking as NIna’s, just in a different way. Huge tumbling and 1% choreography is just as unbalanced a routine as one with mega-easy tumbling and good presentation. Jade is an absolutely amazing tumbler, but she’s not an amazing floor worker. I don’t even think she should be scoring in the top 10 on floor until she adds in some basic level of choreography/presentation, or until the FIG changes women’s floor to straight, silent tumbling.
        She’s getting better and better on vault though.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. @square444 Nope. Problem is, tall and skinny does NOT equal ‘good presentation,’ much though certain judges try to pretend it does. Derwael’s feet suck, both on bars and on floor; her choreography is godawful and she does not put it over at all; she is an indifferent dancer at best. I’m anything but a Carey fan but COME ON. Floor is about three at least decently difficult tumbling passes; Derwael CANNOT EVEN DO THAT.

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      3. Oh I have lots of complaints about Jade Carey’s floor too. I think she got way overscored in both phases of this competition and I am just relieved that she didn’t make floor finals.

        Thing is, Nina is NOT artistic so she shouldn’t be getting high marks for that. So Nina’s floor really has nothing. At least Jade’s has difficult tumbling.

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      1. I agree. The music and choreography actually worked very well – especially the floor work at the end before her final pass. It was exactly the kind of choreography she needed – very dramatic static poses and a nice piece of fluid choreography.

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  4. Since the scores slow in coming, it’s time for Coffee Talk!

    There is an “i” in Miss Seitz’s Elisabeth,
    but there is no “i” in Miss Black’s Elsabeth.

    Talk amongst yourselves…

    Liked by 2 people

  5. Ugh, I hope Black’s injury isn’t serious, as Canada really needs her healthy next year. The landing looked uncomfortable but not that bad. I do give her credit for going for it.

    And once again, Nina gets an incredibly generous score on vault with that giant hop back.

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    1. Derwael has been outrageously gifted with overscores throughout this entire competition. That vault score is a disgrace. Should have been 13.000, tops.

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      1. I do like her FTY in the air – she’s one of the few who doesn’t pike it down at ALL. Her FX score made me furious. Like, smart routine construction I guess, but unwatchable choreography and an example of how badly this Code failed that Derwael’s hoppy landings on two easy tumbling passes was within a tenth of Steingruber’s stuck landings on legitimate tumbling.

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      2. @Anonymous Go to any good NCAA meet and you’ll see Yfulls with much better shapes in the air, and stuck landings. Derwael’s floor AND vault are embarrassingly easy for any gymnast competing at a world championships, and the way they were overscored at this competition was a scandal.

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  6. Feels so bad for lee to mess up on her best event… She pretty much had 1.5 fall there on ub :(… Guess nothing is ever a close to sure thing…

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  7. I love that Nina focuses on neat gymnastics BUT the difference between neat and difficulty is too much and think she is over scored too. Floor should be 3 tumbles minimum and too many leaps spins are allowed to be credited for difficulty. Leaps and jumps don’t bring choreographic artistry in any shape or form. More balanced years ago

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      1. Tall, skinny, and incapable of any decent tumbling skills. To say nothing of a vault which barely makes it in NCAA anymore.

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    1. She gets credit on FX for “neat” gymnastics while Liu Tingting’s actually-completed turns and Tang Xijing’s actually-stuck landings apparently don’t. 😦 Low difficulty apparently only flies if you’re tall, thin and European.

      Cannot believe Spencer said that Tang’s FX was overscored and had nothing to say about Derwael’s. I know he’s not a big China fan but COME. ON.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Bitch Ting ends with a front full. STFU. DOnt use them as your go to to explain! With her double twists and her lame level 10 floor!

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      2. 🙄🙄🙄🙄^ No one is saying Tang is so great on FX.

        Since we need an example of one gymnast being unfairly scored compared to another, it makes sense to compare another low-D, high-E gymnast to Nina. Tang’s execution on her easy tumbling is better than Nina’s – but never gets anywhere near Nina’s E-scores. That’s why it’s insulting that Tang is apparently overscored but Nina isn’t – they’re doing similar things but only one of them gets rewarded.

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    1. You should shoot back that you hope Kara Eaker trips over her chair, lands on her head and is no longer eligible for any alternate position due to injury. Ha ha. 🙂

      Go Ellie the world would rather see a queen like you on beam.

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    2. Reddit’s not a great place to go unless you’re looking for recently-arrived US-only fans who know almost nothing about gymnastics, but think they do. I’m sure they’re all well-intentioned and enthusiastic but the amount of confident idiocy is staggering.

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      1. Right haha when i think of where to go to discuss gymnastics with longtime fans who at least understand scoring and the trajectory of gymnasts over the years, Reddit is not the place i would even think of going. People magazine said Simone finally got a skill named after her this year lol like ummmmm…youre a little late to the party

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    3. Right because BLACK and her lines, and linebacker gymnastics, are just so pleasant to watch? She has baseball mit gymnastics hands> Is this your life?

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  8. Ohh sounds like Simone will be ready to slay the floor during event finals in revenge. She’ll take the floor gold by more than a point. Bet on it.

    🙂

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  9. So delighted for Melnikova to finally get an individual Worlds medal. I’m not a huge fan but she is a sweetheart and has worked so hard. I have also been hugely impressed by her composure on the beam at this Worlds. Three hits out of three! Three strong hits too! Amazing!

    Incredible work from Tang Xijing. She pulled an Italy and leapt from nearly bottom of the standings to the podium (Sam???). When is the last time China won an AA medal at Worlds? Great stuff from her!

    Really good competitions also from Derwael, Seitz, and Saraiva.

    I’m sorry for Suni, who hasn’t had a clean competition yet at this Worlds. Without the fall she easily would have taken a medal ahead of Melnikova. But she is really a huge talent and hopefully will grow as a competitor going forward.

    To be honest, seeing Suni’s struggles (and Grace’s) have made me appreciate Morgan Hurd’s accomplishments even more. In just two World Championships she has won five medals, and not because of her scoring potential, which we all know falls a little short of Lee’s or McCusker’s. What Morgan brings to the table is a champion’s mental game, and you can’t teach that. Very few athletes have it – Simone comes to mind, as well as Aliya Mustafina, and maybe Nina Derwael. I’m sorry neither Morgan nor Mai Murakami were at Worlds this year to defend their podium standings, and I hope we see them both at the Olympics.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. True. Except Morgan was struggling this season. Her mental game wasn’t there at Pan Ams or Nationals and I fear she may have had a not-so-great Worlds had she been named to the team. I think the best thing for her was to use this extra time to rest and heal up before the craziness of next year. I think the extra rest will only help her come back stronger next summer.

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      1. Really? I was impressed by her at Nationals, especially the way she came back from the FX disaster Day 1 to stick virtually everything in her routine Day 2. So fierce. I thought that was a good example of her “mental game” pulling her through. Look forward to seeing her next year.

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    2. Well said about Morgan because I agree about her mental game outshining her scoring potential. She will next year though have to prove she can remain within scoring distance of the others though when it counts. Thats what’s holding her back right now. I hope her making that movie (All Around) isn’t affecting her gymnastics like it did Gabby. Gabby was stronger in 2015 than 2016 maybe because she wasn’t 100% focused on her gymnastics the entire year? Id love to see Morgan come back next year and show she can deliver time and time again because although the US can’t be touched scoring wise, they have a lot to be desired when it comes to consistency, especially in TF. We’ve seen twice now they’ve scored 2 points less in TF vs qualifying

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      1. Gabby looked 100% like she wanted to retire during most of her second quad, and it seemed to me like her family was leaning on her to go to a second Olympics to earn money. Obviously for her it was a great choice financially to go professional as she had lots of endorsements, but I wish she could’ve gone to college – somewhere not too dancy – and gotten to grow up like a normal kid and start a career not based on fading celebrity.

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    3. Yep! Mai, Morgan, Mustafina, and Luo Huan were all rocks for their teams last year who I think have made their presence missed! Hope to see them all next year in Tokyo!

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      1. Love Luo Huan too! I was furious at how much she was lowballed last year at Worlds. Not like it would’ve given her a medal, but it was still unfair. I wish she could upgrade.

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  10. Tang’s silver is the first World AA medal for the Chinese since Yao Jinnan’s bronze back in 2011. Great for them! Tang kind of came out of nowhere (literally, since she subbed in for Tingting)! Kinda gutted for Suni and Melanie since they are both amazing too. Happy for Melnikova too! I’m not the hugest fan of her gymnastics but she is consistent and she’s been working really hard for this.

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  11. So sorry about Suni, but remember this is her first World Championships and maybe the mental game is not yet there. I agree with Derwael… great bars not but an all around gymnast. Ukkk! I just cant’ get behind her gymnastics except for Bars. The judges love her though…I think Morgan probably could have medaled again if she was here. Do we know what Ellie’s injury is? if she was limping off, I am wondering if it is serious enough to keep her out of the finals of Vault and beam. did she make FX finals as well?

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    1. Agree about Morgan… I have been thinking all Worlds that she has really been missed on the US team… I know Grace and Kara were at Worlds last year but they don’t really feel like “veterans” or have the resume/steadying presence that Morgan brings. I don’t have any issue with who they did choose for the team but going to Worlds without Morgan has really felt like missing a limb or something.

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  12. My take on The Nina Situation is that the floor code is broken and that’s not her fault. Like, she has no tumbling difficulty, but how is a 5.0 D going to be the disadvantage it’s supposed to be when your peers are doing more tumbling than that and actually staying in that 5.0-5.3 D range, because dance elements are so harshly judged, most of these gymnasts don’t dare to perform Ds, while Nina does and gets them credited (somehow @ those two wolf turns), so she’s allowed to make up for doing only a D and two Cs as acro.

    People have been better or worse on specific events since always so I don’t resent her using a big bars score to prop herself up, her beam scores are fine, and her vault is the disadvantage it’s supposed to be. Floor is what is supposed to keep her from medals, yet it allows her to stay very close because composition is forced to be terrible worldwide.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. NOPE. Gym history 101: ‘people’ used to be brilliant ALL AROUND gymnasts. Tourischeva, Gnauck, Shaposhnikova, Comaneci, Boginskaya, Silivas, Shoushounova, Miller, Khorkina (barf!), Liukin, and many more gymnasts won multiple world/olympic medals on their ‘weak events.’ Yes, the CoP bites, sucks, and dies, but what is worse is the total fetishization of Derwael because she’s tall and skinny–just like the hideous phenomenon in ballet now of the ‘asparagus ballerina.’ Her vault score is nothing like ‘the disadvantage it is supposed to be’ when she gets ludicrously inflated execution scores for a hop the length of a city block. Her wolf turns, as you mention, are a joke. Her feet are a worse joke. Code whoring of this sort–and obvious judging bias, far worse–is nothing to celebrate.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Yall are complaining about Nina’s vault scores, but this problem is not about Derwael, it’s about vault judging across the board. There is very little differentiation in E scores, and E is almost entirely based on landing. I agree that Nina’s vault should incur deductions for closed hip angle and lack of amplitude, but that is the case for most vaults.

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    2. Like you said, Nina’s floor routine composition is pretty brilliant – there’s very few places to actually take deductions (it’s like that Katelyn Ohashi FX where she only had one pass to stick) and her D score is reasonably close to her competitors.

      I still think she’s wildly overscored on three events. On floor, judges should deduct more for her landings – not stuck, on super easy tumbling – and the occasional messiness of her dance skills. On beam, I think they confuse long legs with extension. Her vault scoring would be fair in a vacuum, but compared to the E-score deductions that everyone else with an FTY gets purely because of the easier vault, Nina is getting massive gifts.

      Liked by 1 person

  13. Let’s all remember that Suni’s Dad is not just still in the hospital, but paralyzed. Just try to imagine that as a 17 yr old. Imagine if that was your Dad, your brother, your spouse. Her entire life is upside down at this point. Off course her mental game is a bit off. I would not even be a functioning adult, and she is a gymnast on the world stage for the first time. Let’s just enjoy her beautiful gymnastics and not question her consistency for the future.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. Consistency has never been Sunisa’s strength, but that’s ok. She is still very talented and has done a good job at her first Worlds.

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  14. Wow!! Tang Xijing and Jiang Yuyuan, the highest placing Chinese gymnasts in the World all-around in history! And they were behind perhaps the two best all-around gymnasts of the decade, 2010 Mustafina and 2019 Biles. Who would have thought two days ago? Congrats to Simone and Gelya as well, such a well-deserved all-around podium.

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    1. No, that is not how it works. There’s a third Chinese gymnast, Chen Yile, who was 2-per-countried out from the final despite placing in the top 8 in qualifications, so if LTT is pulled from the BB final then the spot goes to CY.

      You might get your wish if Ellie Black is too injured to compete, but hopefully not.

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  15. Wow! Tang’s silver medal has completely changed the potential Tokyo Chinese teams as she’s probably the closest you can get to a lock. These are all the gymnasts I see in contention at this point, of course we could be surprised by someone like Liu Jinru but for now these are the ones with a chance:

    Tang Xijing
    Li Shijia
    Liu Tingting
    Chen Yile
    Qi Qi
    Zhang Jin
    Luo Huan
    Ou Yushan
    Guan Chenchen
    Yin Sisi
    Zhou Ruiyu
    Wei Xiaoyuan

    I think at this point you need the first two to compete all four events in team finals, for which LSJ’s qualies performance and TXJ’s AA performance would certainly work.
    Now they need someone for VT and someone for UB, and most of them have strong enough BB/FX that you could just choose between the remaining options.
    VT options include QQ, ZJ, and GCC, with the edge going to QQ for her second vault as well.
    For UB, we realistically have a bit of a dead heat between LTT, CYL, LH, YSS, and OYS. Based on scoring potential, it seems OYS is the frontrunner. I love them all but also think China needs someone consistent there, which is how I think Luo Huan or Wei Xiaoyuan get on the team. China with Luo this year in TF would have surely won the silver.

    As for Tingting and Yile…they are amazing, but between their errors both in last year’s TF and this year’s TF, I hate to say it but I don’t think they can be counted on to hit in Tokyo. But…China will probably have an extra individual spot! Assuming Fan Yilin gets the nominative spot for UB, China could either send one of their vault specialists like Yu Linmin, Deng Yalan, Liu Jinru, or Qi Qi if she’s not on the team, but I reckon they will put either LTT or CYL, who have a real shot at beam gold, in that place instead.

    2018 me wishes there was a way to get LTT, CYL, and LH all to Tokyo, but it’s looking less and less likely…

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    1. What about Li Qi? Whatever happened to her? Lovely on beam of course, and she had the cutest floor routine ever.

      I’m not sure what to make of the Liu Tingting meltdown in TF. It really wasn’t a China meltdown, it was a LTT meltdown – all the newbies did their job. I felt so bad for LTT and she must be absolutely devastated. Never seen her mess up like that before – I think the question is whether it becomes a pattern in the run up to the Olympics, or whether this was just a weird fluke.

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      1. Li Qi struggled with injuries too much and was taken off the national team, I don’t know if it was her decision or her coaches but she is now training with her provincial team. I really hope LTT can figure it out because in terms of raw scoring potential on UB/BB only Ou Yushan can match her! And she deserves to go the Olympics after being injured a couple weeks before Rio…

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  16. AH I just saw that Kara Eaker is back in the BB final! Ellie Black has unfortunately got a bad ankle sprain apparently. Awful news for Ellie, but I am delighted for Kara.

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      1. I hope her and her coach will be able to make the best out of this 2nd chance… Feel so bad wht happened to her earlier..

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      2. That’s a very optimistic outlook to have.

        I’d much rather have seen Ellie in the beam final. Ordinarily I would prefer Kara, but even outside of the D-score issues, she’s looked shakier than normal this worlds and Ellie has been unusually incredible on beam.

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  17. I have to compliment all the women in this all around final. So many scores in the 56s and several more in the 55s. Very few falls and really excellent quality across the board. Tang and Melnikova really hit big when it counted.

    I’d love to see Simone hit a 60 at the Olympics.

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  18. I was really hoping to see Melanie and Suni give their strongest performances, but it was definitely more entertaining seeing who would walk away with medals.

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  19. Not such a splat fest as the Team final was so great news. Suni and Melanie had bad breaks or else they would have medalled. Can’t wait for apparatus finals. Simone is going to clean up!!!

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  20. I’m kind of scared to post this but I have watched the past two days on the Olympic Channel website (cable/subscription login required) – go to “live” and then underneath there is a “replay” section with the most recent final. No ads, very gymnastics-knowledgable (though minimally gymnast-knowledgable) upbeat commentary. No VPN required. Such a welcome alternative to the NBC trio.

    Also wow did we see some beautiful gymnastics today. I’m impressed by Tang – I felt like her vault got no distance but she hit everything else and other contenders didn’t. I’m as always impressed by Black and am so pleased she went for the rudi and so bummed she’s injured. And what a day for Seitz!

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  21. Jesus there’s some spiteful people on here. I thought Nina did a fantastic job. While she might not have the strongest floor and vault she has an excellent beam and exceptional bars. And most importantly what she does, is done well. Almost all AAs have weak events. Hers are outweighed by spectacular bars. To say a FTY has no business in a worlds final is disgustingly elitist. Not all countries have the financial, coaching and publicity backing of the US. Ultimately good form, consistent performance and hit routines will do better than super difficult routines with falls and big wobbles. It’s not that Nina was scored super high, it’s that your favs (e.g. Sunisa Lee) lost the benefit of their difficulty because of their poor performance on this occasion.

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  22. I want to add to my previous comment on Nina and the over allowance of leaps and jumps allowed to be valued in floor and that it doesn’t bring artistry.

    I underemphasised the fact of Nina focusing on neatness. This is a brilliant thing and needs more of that within WA gymnastics, so good for her for that being a focus, it does help with overall future evolution of WA gymnastics again becoming more beautiful/artistic. It is not her fault that she uses the code to her advantage, it is the fault of the code that allows it.
    Nobody can take away her massive achievements.
    It is simply the code that can allow this unbalanced routine construction to occur. My understanding is that the WA technical committee allowed more leaps jumps thinking it will improve artistry but in my view it doesn’t at all. Artistry is a fusion of dance with meaning, soul, extension, amplitude, expression, neatness as the base – you then add this to tumbles and a certain number of leaps and jumps to make it a artistic gymnastics floor routine. A few basic things would first of all improve floor – bring back lunges at the end of tumbles, present rule hasn’t improved landings at all – it’s easy to see what would be a controlled or uncontrolled lunge. It adds the overall look of control, beauty and finish to a tumble. Take out the having to run from one foot, it looks messy and uncontrolled and also doesn’t allow the gymnast to focus on the execution of the tumble to come. Give more time to dance by reducing the amount of allowed tumbles and leaps – 3 tumbles maximum, spins must be finished to show control, simpler leaps and jumps so as to be able to judge extension amplitude flexibility etc rather than these wild leaps and uncontrolled landings from them. Give time for gymnast to show expression, character, extension and beauty. Floor would then regain its beauty of old. Silivas, Dudnik, Laschenova, Lobasnyuk etc etc

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    1. All of this would be fine if Nina actually was an example of good execution. What people have been saying is she is not. My problem is she is overscored on all of her E scores.

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      1. EXACTLY.

        Nina was scored way too high and if you missed that, then you should take a closer look and wonder if you allow her body type to convince you of her “neatness” or “elegance” etc. You should also actually read the content of the earlier comments (maybe not the crazy ones) that very clearly are not just “booo Nina sucks I hate FTYs laaaame.” There are some good explanations there that aren’t just people being mean.

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    2. I disagree with all of those recommendations.

      – Lunges look ugly and while one CAN arguably distinguish between controlled and uncontrolled lunges, it is rare that judges do so accurately (see NCAA!). I hear the arguments about making it safer, but IMO it would be an aesthetic loss.

      – Rather than the stork, they should just penalize standing in the corner before a tumbling pass without moving for more than four seconds, whether you’re on one leg or two. Or give it up and let the Russians catch their breath in the corners. Who cares.

      – More time for dance just sounds like more time for Nina to perform shitty choreography adequately and then get artistry points for being tall, thin, and white. Although there should inherently be some subjectivity in judging artistry, adding more and weighting it more heavily is not going to move the sport in the right direction, unless you think the right direction is to make it look more like badly performed ballet or modern dance.

      Flaws aside, I’d rather see today’s athletes with their harder tumbling, better form, and more diverse choreography than go back to the retro look. FX needs to be fixed, but I don’t think “going back” to the 1980s would not be a step forward.

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      1. Agree with pretty much all of this. I’m glad that we’ve moved beyond the ballet or gtfo style of previous decades. As it is, it’s still fetishized to a disproportionate degree—Brooklyn Moors goes out and does a lovely dance routine with some mostly decent tumbling thrown in and the gymternet collectively faints. I’m not in any hurry to go back to an era where athletes were forced to undergo intensive ballet training in addition to already stressful modern gymnastics training.

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    3. I will argue that even though this code of points allowed Nina to make the floor final, it also won’t allow her to get close to medaling.

      Without difficult tumbling you are always going to hit a wall with your difficulty score. C leaps and D turns will never match decent double doubles and full twisting layouts regardless of how well the are performed.

      The code does award good execution of basic tumbling and dance skills but not to the point where you’re going to surpass the technically strongest tumblers. It allows for people to stay competitive in the all around even with less than difficult tumbling.

      Regarding Nina and difficulty, she’ll always be held back by her FTY. If she can get a DTY by the Olympics then she’ll be one to watch.

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      1. But that just wasn’t true yesterday and this is proved by comparing Nina and Steingruber. Giulia had 4 huge passes including a full twisting DLO and a stuck DLO, along with the best Gogean in the world, and she scored just a tenth over Nina with only 0.2 higher D. That’s what happens when you value a double pike and a double Wolf the same.

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      2. Exactly – and Giulia has fantastic dance elements – they’re much better than Derwaels. You can’t just be like “oh she’s all tumbling.”

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  23. Yes, the idea of dance/artistry in WAG is totally outdated and sexist. Women should be “beautiful” “expressive” “graceful” —- vs. men who should be athletic?? Get with the times, FIG !!!

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  24. I cannot believe what I’m reading. Where the hell did race come into this? Is it not reverse racism to say you only get scored if your tall thin and white – oh what body and race shaming. Could you imagine the comments in reverse and what the reaction would be. I don’t care one bit what the shape, colour is of a gymnast and it is fantastic to see greater diversity in the sport. I’m talking about balance of a routine. Oh and why is it sexist to expect grace etc. a sport is a sport and the emphasise is the emphasis and that’s what makes a difference between the athletes within in any particular sport. If you can’t do it, choose another sport. It’s like saying let a marathon runner do the 100 metres but if they run slow give them a bonus because their body doesn’t allow them to run fast. Like the threads I read about simone biles dismount being downgraded because she is black – why are people finding something that is not there. Let me tell you that I know of an element being given less than it deserved technically on safety grounds in another discipline and this was given to three white girls. Was this because they were white – NO it’s safety and was respected. that’s the same as Simone. People being treated equally.

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    1. IDK. Something feels really, really off about the beam dismount valuation. She’s adding a full twist to an established, accepted skill – there is absolutely no precedent for devaluing something like that, or explanation of why it’s uniquely dangerous. Are they going to randomly devalue the TTY or quad twist on floor when they are eventually performed?

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  25. I do know what you mean re the value and I can comprehend both sides. Your right, is it fair re the skill level BUT she is not being treated unequally as it happens in all disciplines to many gymnasts.

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  26. Just asking for a friend, but are any of you judges? You seem to forget that lots of gymnasts get deducted lots in this code because their jumps/leaps are not 180 degrees or the right shape. And doesn’t it make sense that in a sport called artistic gymnastics, they focus on leaps, artistry and acrobatics? Most of those leaps and turns are not actually that easy? Especially if you want to perform them nicely. For the record flexed feet are a one tenth deduction and not a full point and I don’t really remember seeing any gymnast with any routine on any apparatus with flexed feet in every element xx a friend

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