Well, we’ve already had an arcane team deduction taken for not following vault warmup rules and a late inquiry that changed which athlete got 2-per-country-ed from the all-around final, and we’re not even halfway done. Mary, get ready.
Currently, Russia leads the team competition with 171.629, so that will be the bare minimum aim for the United States, and both qualifying US all-arounders will hope to best Melnikova’s 57.132.
We start subdivision 3 with the US on floor, Netherlands on bars, and Larisa Iordache in her lone event on beam.
One of the big event final issues to watch is going to be Murakami’s 13.933 on floor that already sits in 5th, which we assume will go down to 7th place after the US does floor. Fan Yilin is also already in 4th on bars, which is interesting since there’s more bars depth than floor depth in the later groups.
The first thing to be decided: Which American joins Biles in the floor final.
Athletes out for their intros now. Apparatus feed is going to be especially important because the main feed is just on John and Bridget, the stars of the games.
Touch warmup begins.
And so we live.
McCallum – FX – double double tuck is a problem right off the bat, bounces back OOB – front 2/1, controls the step in bounds – switch ring – split leap full, just a little bouncy – wolf triple and wolf double are strong – full in, keeps it in bounds well, small movement – double tuck, just a little low. She pulled it together after the first pass, but won’t expect a huge score.
NED is still prepping the bars and the US is basically back in the states by now.
Van Pol – UB – toe on to blind to piked jaeger, good height – pak, smooth – maloney – bail to toe shoot, close catch, a dead hang – tkatchev, hit – double pike, small slide. Comfortable start.
13.466 for McCallum.
Godwin – BB – switch moun tot aerial to straddle jump to sissone, really confident start – wolf triple, solid and around – side somi, hit – bhs layo-pike, check – side aerial, hit – back to wolfing for a double – finishes double pike, a bit locked but fine – confident start to her Olympics
Lee – FX – double dobule, hit, chest a bit down, some movement – DLO, solid, again, just a bit forward and a little movement – switch ring and split full look good – double L is around – 1.5 to full – wolf is fine – doubel tuck, big struggle, deep chest, lunge forward
Godwin 12.900 on beam.
It’s 13.433 for Lee, lower than McCallum. Did not get the D she wanted.
Iordache – BB – side aerial, good – bhs tuck full, keeps it on the beam, leg-up check – LARISA NO WHYYYY – she goes for the 3/1 dismount and it’s a huge problem and she’s down and hurt –
Chiles – FX – pulls around her wolf triple – DLO 1/1, good, small slide back – DLO, little bounce up – switch to split full – 1.5 to front full, little hop – double pike secure
Meanwhile Sanne Wevers fell on a Hindorff.
13.566 for Chiles, really got her life for execution there. I’m surprised a bit by that.
Biles – FX – triple double, huge, bounce back – Bile sto stag, very nice – switch full, around – wolf double only, no triple – front full through to full-in, bounces back to Mars and 8000 miles OOB – Simone got Senoh’d – double double, hop back. Will still be a big score, but not that big.
Russia will outscore the US on floor.
Simone gets only 14.133. This scoring is a bit inconsistent with the other rotations. Not egregious, but noticeably tighter.
Skinner – FX – split leap 1.5, slightly out of control – Moors is similar to podium training, a bit short, coming in at an angle, but fine – double double tucked, secure landing – wolf double, slightly out of control – full-in, bounce back – L hop full – front tuckl through to 2.5, lunge forward. Solid.
Skinner ties Chiles on 13.566, Chiles with the better E score.
Really good start for the Netherlands on bars after dropping Sanne’s miss. Everyone else in the 13s.
Carey – FX – last chance for the US to have someone else in floor final – high Moors, some knees and piking, little hop double L turn, hit – front layout to double double, too easy – L hop full – switch full will get docked, well short of split – DLO 1/1, little hop forward – split leap 1.5 attempt, not quite – full in, bounce back. Good work. Should be a top-2 US routine.
Carey goes 14.100, just behind Biles, and that should be safe for floor finals.
So the US with just 41.165 on floor, much lower than they wanted.
So answer 1 is that Carey will join Biles in the floor final.
Van Pol – BB – bhs loso and has to grab the beam to jussst keep herself on – another large break on a switch 1/2, leg up – she stayed on but lots of deductions there.
Lee – VT – DTY, lands short with a lunge to the side and out of the area. 14.333, now conversely I think that’s a little high.
Thorsdottir – BB – falls immediately on layout mount – this is why we can’t have nice things.
McCallum – VT – one of her good ones, DTY with a tone of control, very small movement on landing, just some crappy legs throughout. 14.533. There should be more than 2 tenths of difference between Lee and McCallum’s vaults.
Chiles – VT – DTY is excellent – just a small scoot back in place, great amplitude – 14.700.
Biles – VT 1 – struggles a bit on that Cheng, both feet out of the area, bounces to the side – not great!
That’s a “Skinner and Carey could both beat you” kind of vault performance. She needs to stomp an Amanar.
14.966 for Biles. Could have been harsher.
Biles – VT 2 – Amanar – it’s a great one of course because it always is, but another 3 tenth bound forward. Still goes 15.400 for it, which gives her a 15.183 average, which is excellent.
Skinner – VT 1 – Cheng – lands a littelr more piked than her usual but just a smalltep – still gets a lower score than Biles because of distance and amplitude.
Skinner – VT 2 – Amanar – not her best control there either, a pretty large lunge, has left a door open for Carey definitely.
14.800 second vault for a 14.866 average. Now it’s Carey’s serve.
Carey – VT 1 – Cheng – probably will be the best Cheng score – ragged form but she was right down the center and controlled the landing pretty well with a hop back – 15.166
Nice DLO on floor from Godwin there.
Carey – VT 2 – Amanar – NAILED IT – great work, some of her best vaulting. She’ll be in the final.
15.166 for both vaults, qualifies in 2nd, just behind Biles.
Francis – UB – toe on to toe on to hop off and salute. GIRL IS AN OLYMPIAN.
Sanne – BB – bhs mount – wolf jump full, hit – double L turn, drops leg too early with a check – side aerial to bhs is nice – aerial, small pause before split to bhs full – L turn to full turn to double turn to split leap is BEAUTIFUL – gainer pike full dismount, solid. Some issues at the beginning though.
There will be a lot of talk about Skinner crying here, but like, yeah. This is the last day of her career now and she didn’t make the finals she wanted to.
Still waiting on Sanne’s beam score. She’s calculated it like 3 times by now.
US goes 44.199 on vault, which is the highest vault score of the day so far, but still behind Russia cumulatively.
Meanwhile Jade Carey is leading the US AA standings.
WE’RE STILL WAITING ON SANNE’S SCORE
OK it’s 13.866. Not going to help the defending champ get into the final.
Yes, Skinner in place of McCallum would have increased the US team score so far by .533. Let’ see how that holds up on bars and beam.
Also through all that, Netherlands is still in this thing for making the team final.
Van Pol – FX – high double arabian, little hop, some cowboy – a bit under on her double L attempt – 2.5, jarred landing, bounce forward – 1.5 to front full is secure –
McCallum – UB – stalder full to maloney to pak to stalder shap 1/2, a little leg break on pak but a good combo – piked jaeger is solid – struggles a bit on 1/2 turn on high – FTDT, step back. Starts with 14.100, nice work.
Lieke Wevers – FX – not quite there on a her quad turn, or if that was the quint attempt – double tuck, bounce back – 2.5, good stick – switch ring – split leap full, secure – double L is lovely and around, gets her turn sequence
Chiles – UB – solid piked jager – full to tkatchev – pike dtkatchev to Pak and hits her knees on the mat on the swing through, unexpected mistake – hop on dismount. Just 12.866 for Chiles, so that will need to be dropped. Big hole for Chiles if she’s hoping to make AA.
Thorsdottir FX – 3/1, jars herself back – but the art
Biles – UB – weiler 1/2 to maloney with some crazy legs into tkatchev – toe full, leg break again but gets through it – piked tkatcehv to pak is good – van leeuwen, solid – Fabrichnova, hop back. Sloppier than she wanted but fine.
14.566 for Biles. Don’t know abou tthat makiong it back.
Lee – UB – Nabieva to Bhardwaj, safe one for today – maloney to gienger – piked jaeger to pak to van leeuwen – giant full to FTDT, small hop. Still a great one, should get a big score. Safe and into finals.
15.200 for her easy routine.
Carey – UB – Church to gienger, hit – yezhova, nice – maloney to bhardwaj, good, van leeuwen, strong – giant full – FTDT, small hop
An actively Olympic level bars routine. 14.133, higher score than McCallum.
Skinner – UB – pause in weiler 1/2 but keeps going – tkatchev, hit – Ray to pak, some legs – van leeuwen, leg break, hit – full to Fabrichnova, small hop.
Biles leads the US all-arounders, but only slightly ahead of Carey in 2nd (!), who is a little over 4 tenths ahead of Lee. Lee is very much going to have to hit beam.
This has been delightfully upside down.
McCallum – BB – candle mount, slightly sluggish working out of it but fine – wolf triple and wolf double, comfortable – split 1/2 from side, good – split leap to side aerial to loso, bend to the side check – aerial, good – sissone to full turn was a little slow, watch that space for composition purposes – double pike, step. 13.066.
Yep, I’m assuming they did not give her a dance series.
Chiles is off beam on her side aerial to loso series. She had a bad qualification day and will not make any finals.
Not going to beat Russia with this performance. 11.566 for Chiles.
Lee – BB – wolf triple to wolf double – very clean – aerial to split to bhs – switch ring to split leap, little slow there – switch to switch 1/2 to split ring jump, arm wave – side aerial to loso loso, pulled that out like a damn magician – bhs bhs 2/1, a little under, hop back. Nice work.
14.200 for Lee, currently puts her in 3rd on beam.
Biles – BB – wolf triple, hit – aerial to split to sissone is strong – bhs loso loso, very good – switch to switch 1/2 to back pikle, right on – side aerial, holds it – straddle 1/2 and split 1/2, breaks connection but hits both – bhs bhs full in and over rotates it by 88 miles and bounces way back. Wow. That was great until the dismount. which was not great.
14.200 was just enough to get Lee ahead of Melnikova in the AA.
14.033 for Biles, which puts her 5th on beam.
Carey – BB – aerial to split jump to straddle, hit – bhs loso loso, a little checky, fine – switch to switch 1/2, wobble – split leap to side aerial, strong – switch side very short of split – split 1/2 from side, form but secure – bhs bhs double tuck, step back.
hammered on execution and credit for 12.866, but she’ll be in 2 finals.
Skinner – BB – candle mount, hit – bhs tuck full, secure landing – side aerial to split to straddle – switch to switch 1/2 to back tuck – straddle jump 1/2 to straight jump full, solid – L turn is probably too low, connected to full turn – FTDT dismount, step to the side.
13.233 for Skinner, she;ll end up placing well in the AA.
So so so.
What do we do about this?
The US qualifies into second, more than a point behind Russia. A combination of Russia overperforming expectations and the US underperforming, but there will be a reckoning about this, even if the US pulls it together in the team final as expected.
Ultimately, this team is too talented to be not winning, so if you’re not winning (as you weren’t today), you’re doing something wrong.
And we still have two subdivisions to deal with.
Heduit – BB – Good bhs mount – onodi is pretty – side aerial to loso, small leg slide back – aerial to split – aerial to split – wolf double, just slightly hesitant – 2/1 dismount, lunge back. Good start! 13.200
Oh dear, Ava Stewart starts for Canada with a fall on her Y1.5. 12.933.
Steingruber sticks her double front on bars
Moors – VT – handspring front full, well she pulled it out, deepish, lunge forward, but she fell on that in her last warmup, so this was better. 14.133 is kind.
Black – VT – really strong handspring front 1/1, just some knee bending , good control
Boyer – BB – this is a big one – round off layout is hit, shuffle back – switch to switch 1/2, little hesitation – split leap to aerial to split, good, just short of position on the switch leap – HUGE break on L turn, big wobble, possible beam grab – side aerial, good – side somi, hit – split 1/2 from side, secure – double pike, hop to the side.
Black with a Tsuk 1.5 second vault, also under control.
14.416 average for Black – that’s 6th on vault –
13.466 for Boyer even with the big break. Better than she has been most of the year.
Olsen – VT 1 – Cheng – goood jobbbb, really good for her – not too scrappy on the form and great landing control. 14.966.
Olsen – VT 2 – DTY, hop back chest down but also solid, easy final
Popa – FX – DLO, good, just a tad short – front loso to full in is reallly short, chest down and a lunge
DJDS – front pike mount, great – front pike, same, very secure – bhs layout, nailed – switch to wolf, good – split jump 1/2 from side – switch 1/2, nice extension – aerial to split, a bit short – switch ring, arm wave – double tuck, does not go for upgraded dismoutn, step forward. Great work.
13.233 is prettty low for that for me. Broke too many combos.
It looked like it was going to be badddd for Canada but they end with a very nice 43.632 on vault.
Bechdeju – VT – good clean FTY, hop in place –
Steingruber – BB – switch mount, little check – front tuck, arm wave – loso series, leg-up check – front pike, secure –
Moors – UB – shaposh to pak – toe full – van leeuwen – clear hip to blind change to khorkina, through it – toe tuck 1/2, stuck landing. Our girl survived this Olympic bars routine. For a 13.000!
Popa – VT – hits her DTY, good direction, pretty large lunge back
Stewart – UB – inbar to stalder full to inbar shap to tkatchev, good combination – Stalder tkatchev piked – swing to pak, a little ragged in form – van leeuwen, good – stalder – double front pike and nooooooooo falls on her hands and knees. Well, now Canada will have to make TF so she has another shot at it.
Nice split work from Luciana Alvarado on beam.
Stewart still gets 12.900, just one tenth below Moors, and still above what Olsen would get if she went. But that needed to be a big score.
De Jesus Dos Santos – FX – DLO 1/1 and stuck, yes you did, just a little bit of pike – FTDT, bounce back, great position in the air – – switch ring and switch full, a little ragged – front loso to double tuck and bounces back OOB – double pike
I just loooked down to the bars stream to see Ellie Black having to do some extra swing recorrecting that I was not expecting. Just 12.800 for Black. Brooklyn Moors is going to have the top bars score for Canada nbd.
Just 13.166 for DJDS on floor. She’s not getting the numbers so far.
Olsen – UB – blind to piked jaeger, caught with legs throughout – bail, probably no handstand credit – and my stream went to commercial in the middle because…
Boyer – FX – 2.5 to front tuck, lunge forward and OOB – double L turn around, connects to double turn – double tuck, hop back – wolf double, fine – double pike, step back – leg-up hop full is really nice –
So anyway, that’s the end of two rotations and everything is going terribly.
And Canada still has to do beam.
Moors – BB – front tuck mount, hit – switch to split ring jump, flexed back foot on switch – fhs to front tuck, a bit deep but held it – side aerial, large break, leg-up wobble and another arm wave – rudi dismount, stuck! Stayed on. For 13.300, she’s having a good day so far.
Heduit hits a DTY, large lunge back – 14.233
De Jesus Dos Santos – VT – DTY is GREAT, stick landing, just a little off to the side. There she is.
Stewart – BB – wolf double, good – switch to wolf – bhs tuck full and falls. Well, she’s having the worst possible day after being so consistent all year – and…it’s a second fall for Stewart
Friess with a strong rudi for France, just a little piked at the beginning, chest up, small hop back. 14.966!
Popa – UB – great heigh piked jaeger – Nabs! Hit – Church to pak, good – toe full gets a little funky – shaposh to gienger, somewhat close – DLO 1/1, great shape in the air, hop to the side
Black – BB – switch mount to switch 1/2, wobble check – korbut – double turn is nice – straddle jump – front pike, hit – bhs to tuck full, keeps it on the beam, wobble – bhs layout, secure – side somi – doubel pike, chest down, step to side. 13.900!
Good 14.400 for Popa on bars.
Steingruber – FX – DLO, bounce back – huge popa – front tuck through to double tuck, step back – doubel pike, very secure – switch full – 13.300
Olsen – BB – aerial, hit – onodi, also pretty secure – side somi, lean hesitation – not a lot of connecting happening – switch to switch 1/2, not bad – bhs loso loso, way off line, you could tell from the start – Canada will count a beam fall – illusion – bhs bhs double pike, good stick there.
12.066 for Olsen, so Canada will be in a hole now but still very much in this to make TF. They don’t have to be that great on floor to pass NED and stay ahead of Spain.
France is in very good shape to make TF now.
Stewart – FX – 1.5 through to double pike, hop back – 2.5 to front tuck, pulls out the landing – a little short – solid leap positions – double tuck, really rough, nearly falls back but doesn’t so comes up with a hit on the day
Petisco alls on a punch front on beam, scraping down the side
Heduit – UB – stalder full to shaposh to ricna, good – piked jaeger – Ray to pak, clean – van leeuwen, some crazy legs but through it – double front, holds the landing. Solid.
Olsen with good control on her double double on floor –
Good DTY from Lihie Raz on vault
De Jesus Dos Santos – UB – Nabieva (some straddle) to pak to maloney to bhardwaj – lovely combiantion – van leeuwen, legs together – inbar with a bit of an arch – front giant full – DLO 1/1, shortish, two steps forward.
Black – FX – front full to 3/1, gets is around just – little hop – 2.5 through to double pike nooo well short and it looked like hands down – even Ellie Black is having a bad day – front 2/1 to front tuck, slide
it’s beam hit for Popa though, so perhaps the curse is lifted.
Steingruber – VT 1 – rudi is nice and high – lands under control, chest just down. 14.833
14.566 on bars puts DJDS in 7th but with Derwael and Seitz still to come.
Steingruber VT 2 – DTY, again lands chest pretty well down but good control, step forward.
14.566 puts Stringruber into just 6th on vault.
Moors – FX – Podkopayeva is a little too farward, chest down and a step – front 2/1 to front full, lunge, lean to keep herself in bounds – perfection loso side pass – switch ring and switch 1/2, good – rudi to split jump and some travel
Chuso – VT 1 – handspring rudi, it’s around, chest down, hop to the side and out of the area – 14.500
A big bars rotation gets Frane ahead of GB and into 4th! Big result.
Chuso – VT 2 – Tsuk 1.5, lands short, lunge back.
Well, that shouldn’t make it back to finals.
13.533 for Moors will not make it back to the floor final either. I hate it.
Chuso getting a standing ovation from all the people there as she comes up short of the vault final.
Canada does, however, get ahead of the Netherlands to sit in 8th place. They’ll have to wait to see if Germany or Belgium can pass.
We’ve got a little nap break before this insanity continues and we find out who makes finals.
63 thoughts on “Women’s Olympic Qualification – Subdivisions 3 & 4”
On the one hand, I want to say that rules are rules. Disagreeing with them doesn’t justify ignoring them when there are known/clear consequences at stake…
On the other hand, sucks that GB Team suffers another hit after the Downie drama…
But back on that other hand, I don’t see how team penalties are anymore/anyless “arcane” than any other rules of the game or how warmup rules are “not about the gymnastics”…when they arguably are…
What is this scoring? Biles behind Ferrari on floor?
Well yeah, Simone catapulted herself to Mars mid-routine. It’s a miracle she scored as well as she did!
I’ve said this many times before, but Simone can’t just do anything on floor for a guaranteed gold. She should be scoring in the mid-15s based on her difficulty and her execution in the air. Unfortunately, she’s struggled with landings all year and today was no exception.
Simone’s landing errors are often a combination of 0.3 steps and 0.3 out of bounds deductions. I wouldn’t be surprised if they counted one 0.3 step, one 0.1 step, and then 0.3 out of bounds for a 0.7 in landing deductions on her third pass alone (plus deductions for a severe over rotation of her full-in). And her first pass also had a 0.3 step plus a leg up deduction (0.1 or 0.3).
really bugging me that they don’t show more of the USA routines – I understand they are showing everyone, but we don’t need to see someone adjusting their grips while skinner is on floor. would have liked to have seen that one.
Switch to the event feed! It’s great.
thanks i found it!
There is a feed that shows just the US routines – https://stream.nbcolympics.com/gymnastics-womens-qualification-subdivision-3-team-usa-tracker
ooooh Jade Carey showing that she 100% deserves to be in Tokyo. So many doubters all season but she was just saving her best for when it really counts. She also just showed that maybe the US SHOULD have given up her individual spot because they really could have used these scores in qualification for the team.
The individual US gymnasts had their best ever performance collectively!
Imagine what the team score would’ve been with a team of biles, lee, carey, and skinner… lol
anyone have a way to watch the NBC stream from out of the country? This intl. coverage is just horrible – I mean we’re Canadian and all we want to see is the US – how can they possibly show so little of these amazing athletes.
Use a vpn connected to a US server.
There really shouldn’t be any talk about Skinner being upset after vault just as there shouldn’t have been any talk after Biles got upset during day 2 trials. Being upset and showing emotion after not doing your best or being outranked by someone else is just being human. Neither of them had inappropriate outbursts. It’s especially painful for Skinner who will now most likely be the only US woman gymnast not to get a medal. That cannot be an easy thing to process regardless of how mentally strong you are.
If Carey ends up making the AA final, that WILL trigger a lot of conversation. She’s had the absolute meet of her life through 3 events. I cannot believe she’s on the cusp of being the 2nd AAer!! Good for her!
At this rate, Simone should do the Yurchenko double pike in the team final. Also, the judging is really terrible…for everyone.
skinner should’ve been on the team!! She is a gamer! wish she could’ve qualified for a final but this was definitely one of her best ever performance on the biggest stage! Something she won’t forget no matter if she didn’t get a medal
Wow, it looks like both Skinner and Carey would have decisively been on the highest scoring team along with Biles and Lee based on qualification scores.
Very sadly Chiles, who was supposed to be a rock, has reverted to 2019 trials levels of choking. And I don’t have much confidence in McCallum to bring big enough scores to really replace her… I bet they’re really wanting Skinner’s vault score now for these finals… yikes
i think they really wish they could’ve had a team of biles, lee, and skinner now. I am a little sad for skinner but honestly, she really went out on a high note. No regret!
biles, lee, carey, skinner team
Biles, Lee, Carey, Skinner would’ve been the highest scoring team, but who could’ve seen that coming what with Carey not bothering to compete the all around in any competition this season until now. And Chiles was an absolute rock all season, so you can’t really dispute her placement on the team given the information Tom had prior to Olympic qualifications.
I think Tom made the best decision he could. After that its up to the athletes to step up and perform and they didn’t.
Agreed! A lot of underperformance tonite!
Well, that was the most stressed I’ve been watching the US women since maybe 2008 TF? I mean, being a only a point behind Russia with them being almost perfect and the US being a disaster doesn’t have me thinking the US won’t win, but still. Yikes!
Sad for Netherlands likely being out of the TF, but also glad Japan looks better to make it in.
Also relieved Suni didn’t get 2 per’d out of the AA final.
Maybe Simone should’ve done the double double off beam, given how overcooked her dismount was?
I do hope Mckayla goes for world’s this year. If either Simone or Jade doesn’t go, she’ll casually win a vault medal.
I agree wholeheartedly. A lot of the gymnasts who are retiring should reconsider. The worlds after the Olympics is historically the weakest since you have a lot of post-Olympics retirements and gymnasts trying to figure out the new code. Gymnasts like Skinner might find the extra 3-4 months of training worthwhile if event and all around medals are in reach.
I don’t think Tom’s going to win any Greatest Team Coordinator awards.
Wow. I knew Tom made a huge mistake including McCallum and not Skinner on the team. Betcha’ he wishes he could have Skinners vault score now for team finals. I know Chiles deserved to be on team based on her meets this year, but I’ve been really worried about her lack of international experience. Nerves really got to her tonight…a la McCool in Athens.
Huh? All of McCallum’s scores counted for the team.
Actually, you’re correct. My bad. I just think that for finals they are going to need Skinner’s vault score. Going to be close with Russia.
That’s part of the problem though. They had to rely on all 4 of her scores and the US is now in second. This was basically a real-lifetest of the “Grace is an AA-backup” narrative and it unfortunately didn’t work out.
yeap they did….
Counting all of Grace’s scores is exactly the problem. Which unreliable AA person do you put up in the TF – Grace or Jordan? They’re both fantastic gymnasts, but the problem isn’t today, it’s the TF when 3 up, 3 count. Are they only going to use Jordan for VT/FX instead of Suni and have Simone and Grace up on all 4? Seems the wisest choice at the moment. Grace as the built in AA back up might save them or be the downfall. It’s too bad the team wasn’t set up so that everyone knew who would be doing what and exactly what scores you could count on so kneejerk decisions aren’t made last minute.
I still think the US will win in TF regardless, but that’s mostly because I expect Russia and China to fall apart. Surprises can happen though!
Ok, I should stipulate that I’m a legit PhD in quant methods. So math, statistics, causal inference I get…but gymnastics is something entirely different.
I just want to make everyone ready to torch Tom F to pause, breathe, and ask yourselves whether tonight’s results were less about his decisions and more about:
2) Jordan’s off day
3) Biles’ off day
4) Skinner’s scores if replaced Grace…because even then, US would be in 2nd
The main problem that I, and many others, had with the team selection is that by picking McCallum over Skinner, you gave up a guaranteed high vault score with the possibility that McCallum could cobble together enough tenths across events that she has shown no consistency on.
Now I can’t argue with the rest of the team. Chiles’ selection was a no-brainer based on everything she showed all year. Biles and Suni don’t even require explanation for why they’re on the team.
Chiles’ overall 2021 performances across 5 days of competition solidified her as the most consistent gymnast and the one who could be relied on on event for any stage of the competition. With that being said, I really am at a loss now for what’s going to happen for team final. My immediate guess is that Chiles will be used for vault and floor only and then McCallum will have to pull off the all around in team finals.
I think biles just had an off day. I think she will scores at least 1.5 points higher in TF.
As for mccallum vs chiles in TF, I don’t know…. mccallum did have her own problem also in 2019 TF so…. I guess the question is how much you think you can gamble on chiles with what’s gonna be even higher pressure….
that is true. US did really f up. They do need a wake up call once a while.
Not sure how to explain what happened to chiles beside the pressure getting into her since she really went south as compared to endless hits so far this yr before this. Grace kinda underperformed a bit too but not as bad as chiles.
If US don’t get their act together, they are definitely in trouble!!!
But I am glad the individual US gymnasts did have their best ever day collectively!
It doesn’t matter if USA would still be 2nd in qualification if Skinner’s scores replaced Grace’s, the Team should have been constructed to be as competitive as possible for an actual 3-up-3-count lineup. That has constantly meant Skinner or Leanne Wong for the 4th spot, not Grace McCallum. This isn’t the first time Grace was selected at the expense of the Team score or possible event medals. Skinner for Vault and Leanne for Floor were also built-in Floor medalist alternates, if Jade wasn’t performing her best.
Riley McCusker was needed in the individual spot too, in order to shore up a medal potential area that USA actually needed help in. The way she got scored domestically wouldn’t have dropped at the Olympics either, IMO. The judges like that form. For me her Day 2 routine at Nationals is the best from anyone in competition the past 5 years, aside from Suni’s best. She was a very real medal threat.
I will cry ugly tears if Larissa qualifies for beam and is too injured to compete.
“…we’re so so fortunate that our athletes are so strong that I don’t think it’s going to come down to tenths of a point in Tokyo. We didn’t feel like it was worth changing the integrity of the process simply for a couple of tenths.” –Tom Forster
really tom really. Oh wait now for the first time in 10 years team usa is in 2nd place. Karma’s a bitch, isn’t it?
To be fair, they’d still be in second place if Skinner were the 4th team member. It was just an all around bad day for the U.S. I really think the pandemic hurt the us. Our strategy has always been to obsessively do routine after routine after routine for two straight years until the gymnasts can do them blindfolded and never fall. That wasn’t possible this time around and the lack of numbers is showing.
It’s more Tom said, I’m going in rank order cause we’re gonna win anyways instead of sending the highest-scoring team. Now for the first time in 10 years, Team USA is in second place. The man needs to be fired.
Why does he need to be fired? He chose the correct team. His other option would’ve put the U.S. in the same position they’re in now. Numbers-wise, his decision isn’t bad. The U.S. didn’t perform their best. You can’t blame him for that. He’s neither the athlete nor the athlete’s coach. He did his job. The gymnasts didn’t do their’s. At some point, you’ve got to blame the actual athletes for their performances and stop blaming the administrators.
I mean the lack of number of routines also seen with other teams as well due to covid.
On top of Biles saying she may only be back as a specialist for 2024, Tom is gonna have some real work cut out for him now….
Hell, they might even have to ask skinner and carey to come back…lol
Some of y’all are saying this was a bad or even a horrific day for the US. I didn’t think it was *that* bad, which is what has me worried for team final. Simone was very bouncy, which lost probably at least 2 points from the team total across FX, VT, and BB. But she’s also been very bouncy for a while now. Aside from that, we didn’t have that many big errors. Chiles dragged her feet on bars and fell on beam. Aside from that, everyone basically performed as they have all year. That’s not nearly as big a cushion as we’re used to seeing the past couple quads.
The team seemed to be nervous and lacking energy the whole session. Not a lot of cheering or congratulating. I expect that to change heading into TF. I expect Biles to clean up her landings. Those are likely to be enough to carry the US to gold, even if Russia has another great day. Fingers crossed.
Which means the rest of the world is catching up to the U.S. That’s a good thing for this sport and something that makes me happy to see. I’d rather watch an actual nail-biter of a competition than a blow out. Way more exciting that way.
No. Which means Russia is obscenely overscored and the US has no idea what they will do when they lose Biles, which will be soon. There is nothing exciting about watching the ugly and rudimentary tumbling or vaulting of most of the Russian gymnasts. They are ahead here because they lucked out and hit beam for the first time in approximately FOUR YEARS while the US had a rotten day. That is all.
They actually lost a bunch of tenths on wolf turns on floor, both Suni and Jordan.
I am so tired of people saying Tom made a bad choice putting Grace on the team. He chose her cause of her consistency and she proved it by all of her scores counting along with Simones. Suni had the lowest on floor and vault and Jordan had the lowest on bars and beam. And for those saying Mckayla should have been on the team, guess what, if she were they would have still ended up in 2nd place. Her scores would have made no difference in the outcome. Grace doesnt deserve the abuse she is getting.
Agreed. Skinner or McCallum. It wouldn’t have mattered. We would’ve placed where we did with either gymnast. And I don’t think Tom made a bad decision. The gymnast who performed the worst was Chiles and given her consistency across Winter Cup, camp, Classics, Nationals, and Trials, the decision to put her on the team was a good one. McCallum did what she was put on this team to do which was step up and fill in when we had problems. Any other team composition amongst the top 5 placements at trials would’ve gotten the same results. What it comes down to is that the U.S. isn’t as dominant as it has been the last 2 quads. The world is catching up and that’s a good thing for the sport.
Counting all of Grace’s scores is exactly the problem! Why is Grace
using a sissone + full turn as her dance combination?! It’s so risky & she’s been wobbly on it. She only got a 5.2 D score because she didn’t get the dance combo requirement, stepping up with more problems when others had even bigger problems, is helping, but I mean…
McCallum didn’t ‘step up’ and isn’t consistent. What it comes down to is that you can’t deal with reality. Forster is a boob who couldn’t tell his ass from a hole in the ground, and will be fired if he’s managed to LOSE the team gold (which given the vomitous overscoring of Russia is more than possible.)
What consistency. Grace barely hit anything this entire season. She fell at worlds. Grace is not consistent and we need to stop saying it.
Okay! She bounced out on floor. She missed her dance requirement on beam a 5.2 isnt really helping without her dance requirement. This isn’t domestic scoring anymore where Grace has been gifted. That routine she did on beam would have gotten a 14+ at home.
I personally don’t think it’s fair to bring in Grace’s TF fall from 2019 into the conversation, just as I don’t think that Chiles’ 2019 problems should have factored into the team selection either.
With that being said, Grace made the team really because she was up against incredibly inconsistent competition at trials (i.e. Wong, DiCello, Eaker, Malaybuyo, etc.). Her scores were weak all season long but she made the team because she was less weak than everyone else and Tom decided to use trials AA scores as the sole decision maker. It simply doesn’t bode well when your inclusion on the team is based on having a slightly less worse day than everyone else especially without having a must-have score on any event. Skinner DID have that must-have score even without a stronger-all around because of how team scores work. If Grace was also scoring like Chiles and Lee all season in the all-around then there would have been zero question about her inclusion on the team – but she hasn’t scored that way since 2019.
However, we also have to acknowledge that Skinner’s scores also wouldn’t have made enough of a dent in the US’s score deficit to Russia. Grace is not to blame alone and shouldn’t be the only one blamed. No one performed at their full potential excluding Carey and Skinner. Biles and Chiles each left 3 points on the table and Lee can do a much better floor than she did in qualification. Grace also has much more potential as we all know, but I’d be very wary to count on that potential when it has not yet materialized at any point so far in 2021.
An interesting but irrelevant fact is that a Biles, Lee, Carey, Skinner team would have placed ahead of Russia… Carey would have contributed higher scores on vault, bars(!!!), and floor and Skinner would have contributed higher scores on vault, beam(!!!) and floor.
Saying “it makes no difference” isn’t really fair either, though, because it does make a difference to the person who could have contributed to a higher team score but won’t get a medal.
This is going to be too late on the comments to have any affect, but I just have to get it out there…
Here’s an idea … let’s SUPPORT the gymnasts who are at the Olympics while they are in the midst of the experience rather than tearing apart the team and coaching. As if they don’t have enough pressure on them at the moment, already. Do you really think this pressure isn’t getting back to them from the community that is supposed to be cheering them (Grace) on? Then if they falter under the pressure there is a general ‘I told you so’. I’d love to see those who are tearing apart McCallum do a fraction as well as she has under this kind of scrutiny.
Bravo, Grace! Ms McCallum did exactly what was asked of her – she performed consistent routines on every single piece of equipment with scores to count on every single one of them – more than most of the rest of the team. She also did so in the lead-off position while others (i.e. Skinner) had the benefit of going later in the rotation when scores generally build. Whatever the belief who was on anyone’s dream 4 person team, like it or not those 4 ladies are on the team and in midst of the Olympic meets. They need your support, not snark (That includes you, Jessica and Spencer). Snarking now serves no purpose other than to increase the pressure on individual members and does nothing to further the discussion in the moment. In the name of sportsmanship, how about supporting and encouraging Team USA so they feel that support and leave the woulda-coulda-shoulda for a useful conversation as soon as the active competition is over?
Grace had a great Olympic Trials – better than those who scored less than her. Good for her! Many sports rely on OT for team selection. Skinner has historical notorious poor form. As pointed out, it has been improving, however the international judges clearly saw it as well.
I notice not one mention of Tom clearly coaching Skinner regarding her beam candle mount that consistently has not hit vertical during the podium training broadcast. I have noticed the deduction every meet it’s been shown. Thank you, Tom. Because of your coaching she may have decreased her deduction on beam.
Would be interesting to go back in these podcasts/blogs for all the comments when it was time to (rightfully) hate on the Karolyi’s and how unhealthy the emphasis on medals, medals, medals was. And yet here we are in the same situation ….
I find your BRAVO POLLYANNA perception nauseating and not in touch with reality. Grace did ok. Just ok. Others did worse. Quit the erasure because you feel upset about differing opinions on the matter.
And still its not even about Grace. Its Tom!
Thank you. They’re almost as emetic as “April E” which is really saying something.
Did people understand Jade’s beam score? I thought they scored her a little low on beam…what do people think? I never see the full three points they take away for execution when they give people sevens anyway…curious to hear what other people think…
I think Jade and MyKayla were scored a bit too harshly, however, they do have several built-in 0.3 deductions for amplitude and form. However, I would have had their E-scores in the upper 7s rather than low 7s based on what we saw.
I never see MyKayla’s execution deductions either, though…
Matt Baker usually talks a load of overexcited nonsense on the BBC, but today he mused that part of USA’s problems may be the lack of a crowd and I think he’s onto something for once. Certainly everything I’ve watched so far, not just gymnastics, is completely devoid of atmosphere and Tokyo has made no effort to create one. I thought the USA women looked like they were going through the motions – I know qualifying safely is important, but that was not their A-game at all.
When Tom was chosen as National Team Coordinator, I cringed. Obviously, the need to put athlete safety first was paramount, but in selecting Tom, the integrity of the US program was compromised because, how do I say this, Tom is kind of a wimp in decision making processes. He should have been placed in some sort of role that only analyzes how the team culture is developing after the big scandal. He shouldn’t be in charge of anything strategic when it comes down to training, selecting a team, or making team decisions. He simply doesn’t have what it takes. This was the case even before the Olympic team was selected. And once the decision was made, Tom took the easy way out and hid behind the numbers (AKA all round scores speak for themselves), thereby re-adopting a 1991 USA gymnastics philosophy full of criticism. True, the US doesn’t have the depth it had the last 2 olympic cycles (for example, it’s the first time the Americans won’t have two amanars in the team final since London), but we also can’t forget that the pandemic severely messed everyone up, which makes this a big, empty, weird olympic games with more injuries than medals (Poor MyKayla, having to give an Olympic farewell waving to empty bleachers after beam). OK…Tom rant over for now.
Let’s move to the BIGGEST culprit and WINNER of this USA debacle: The FIG, who is sitting back in its chair laughing like Dr. Evil for two reasons: (1) they allowed juniors who wouldn’t have been eligible to compete in 2020 to compete in 2021 (yet we still call these games the “2020” games to represent, well, the best of 2020) and (2) they know the US would not have had these problems to the same degree with a five member team. So, indeed, these two decisions have produced the biggest American frustrations at these games. Big win for the FIG.
Finally, does anyone else think the US team spends too much time on social media/their phones during competition?
Plus, it’s just the concept of saying that tenths of a point don’t matter in a sport where they do, in my opinion.
Wow, I just saw Tom Forester’s wife’s rant on the Gymcastic twitter page. What’s terrifying is that neither Tom nor his wife actually can grasp the underlying reasoning and logic behind the complaints. They actually think Tom’s done everything right and have made gymnastics better.
And just as disappointing as Tom Forester is the useless, ineffective, and seemingly unknowledgeable CEO Li Li Leung who apparently has no discernable voice or role in USA gymnastics whatsoever. She was installed as CEO to prevent this continued mismanagement and hasn’t done what she’s needed to.
Simply put, Tom has created chaos in his 3 years as coordinator. He has put gymnasts mentally and physically through the wringer by not providing them any clue what they need to do to make teams. To this day, we have zero idea if Riley had a greater than 0% chance of making the individual spot or if she was risking further injury for a spot that was literally impossible to get.
Falling back on the 2016 selection process to justify this year’s selection is not helpful to anyone because the correct team was selected for Rio. Of course Skinner absolutely had the right to be upset. Anyone who makes it that close and misses out is going to be upset. She gave the performance of a lifetime at those trials and was certainly close numbers-wise, but she simply didn’t have the right strengths for that particular team. There was a gaping hole on bars that was not going to be satisfactorily filled without both Kocian and Douglas because Raisman didn’t have the D or E scores on bars and Hernandez didn’t have the consistency. Whatever mathematical advantage Skinner would have provided on vault wouldn’t have surpassed Gabby’s bars advantage.
Now we don’t know what gymnasts were told prior to the 2016 trials. We don’t know if gymnasts knew that maximized team score would be the main decider or if they were under the impression that AA results would have the most weight. I remember reading that even Simone was holding her breath about being selected. So there’s a good chance the selection criteria was not clearly stated which is a huge problem.
These possible issues with the 2016 selection weren’t fixed in 2021. Tom stated that the team score would be maximized and then selected a 4th gymnast who was not even in the top 3 scoring teams based on multiple methods of calculation. It’s just absurd what has happened.
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